Re: Interesting eBay Auctions
Posted: October 15th, 2019, 2:19 pm
Butchers running wild.
Apparently, there were 15 jewelled 618s in 6152 and 6154. Which for me adds to the probability of this 618 being in a build and passed on as gen in some years time ... a scam like that is pretty much the only thing that can explain the price.
I think that those may have all been from pocketwatches originally. Many of these watches were assembled from leftover parts after the original Panerai shut. The 6154s for sure were never issued as finished watches (these were unissued prototypes); the "References" book 6154 example has a 622 ("Elinvar") movement claimed to be an original 618 movement (which sold for big money as being all original). It makes no sense for Panerai/Rolex to take a step down in quality from a 17 jewel movement and downgrade to a 15 jewel movement later. Why would they do that, especially after the war, when even during the war they were still fitting 3646 watches with 17 jewel 618 movements? Also, why would they issue some 6152 watches with 17 jewel movements and others with 15 jewel movements? I don't think a big company like Rolex would be inconsistent in what they produce; everything would be from uniform batches and not mixed types, especially in the 1950s. To me, the far more likely explanation is that the few watches with 15 jewel movements are frankenwatches that have pocketwatch movements.
This makes sense. But as long as there's an Wiegmann/Ehlers book with pictures of vintage Ps with 15 jewelled 618s, someone's gonna take advantage and use that as «proof», and someone's gonna believe it and get scammed. I'm sure we'll see this 618 resurface at some point, and by then no longer in a pocket watch ...Sandwich wrote: ↑October 15th, 2019, 5:03 pmI think that those may have all been from pocketwatches originally. Many of these watches were assembled from leftover parts after the original Panerai shut. The 6154s for sure were never issued as finished watches (these were unissued prototypes); the "References" book 6154 example has a 622 ("Elinvar") movement claimed to be an original 618 movement (which sold for big money as being all original). It makes no sense for Panerai/Rolex to take a step down in quality from a 17 jewel movement and downgrade to a 15 jewel movement later. Why would they do that, especially after the war, when even during the war they were still fitting 3646 watches with 17 jewel 618 movements? Also, why would they issue some 6152 watches with 17 jewel movements and others with 15 jewel movements? I don't think a big company like Rolex would be inconsistent in what they produce; everything would be from uniform batches and not mixed types, especially in the 1950s. To me, the far more likely explanation is that the few watches with 15 jewel movements are frankenwatches that have pocketwatch movements.
I stand corrected; erlendh was right. Apparently there are some well documented 6152 watches with 15j 618 movements. So that makes things even messier and harder to sort out original from franken.Sandwich wrote: ↑October 15th, 2019, 5:03 pmI think that those may have all been from pocketwatches originally. Many of these watches were assembled from leftover parts after the original Panerai shut. The 6154s for sure were never issued as finished watches (these were unissued prototypes); the "References" book 6154 example has a 622 ("Elinvar") movement claimed to be an original 618 movement (which sold for big money as being all original). It makes no sense for Panerai/Rolex to take a step down in quality from a 17 jewel movement and downgrade to a 15 jewel movement later. Why would they do that, especially after the war, when even during the war they were still fitting 3646 watches with 17 jewel 618 movements? Also, why would they issue some 6152 watches with 17 jewel movements and others with 15 jewel movements? I don't think a big company like Rolex would be inconsistent in what they produce; everything would be from uniform batches and not mixed types, especially in the 1950s. To me, the far more likely explanation is that the few watches with 15 jewel movements are frankenwatches that have pocketwatch movements.