Interesting eBay Auctions
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Re: Interesting eBay Auctions
Congrats on the 1000th post in this topic mykeos!
- TimemiT
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Re: Interesting eBay Auctions
Just thinking ... the Type 1 would be the Non-incabloc 17 Jewel, the Type 2,3 & 4 would be Incabloc with only the Type 2 having 15 jewels engraved in a different manner. Based on the photo's I have seen online from Perezscope.
Weren't these movements issued by Rolex to Panerai in a sequence of serial numbers stamped on the plate? A very limited series of serial numbers? Any build with a serial stamping on the movement that was outside of this range would be suspect? Or would those Rolex 618 movement's be stamped all manner of numbers?
Only thing that would attract me would be to have a movement like this as a backup (for my genuine build) ... if it ever needs parts?
Weren't these movements issued by Rolex to Panerai in a sequence of serial numbers stamped on the plate? A very limited series of serial numbers? Any build with a serial stamping on the movement that was outside of this range would be suspect? Or would those Rolex 618 movement's be stamped all manner of numbers?
Only thing that would attract me would be to have a movement like this as a backup (for my genuine build) ... if it ever needs parts?
Alpacalypse Now
- Sandwich
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Re: Interesting eBay Auctions
I've collected a few serials of genuine 618s and Cort 616s (many of which were posted on the old HF); there are very few but they fall across a large range. I think Cortebert ran batches inbetween producing 616 batches; they are interspersed because the batches were interspersed. It would be pretty tough to have a complete enough serial number base to know what is real and fake because the range is so huge, unless a serial is very close to a known example.
I'm not so sure about that typing scheme and the inca. I thought only the very late movements in the 1950s had inca. I don't think original 3646 movements had it, just some of the later 6152 movements. All the info from the books is highly suspect because they claim many frankenwatches are original, and Perez uses a lot of conjecture (which is easy for disproving fakes, but very difficult for proving originals).
I wouldn't use this movement for a build because it's pretty clear from the markings that this is a movement from a pocketwatch that was not used in gen watches. I don't think it's any more "gen" than using an elinvar 622 movement, except that it more closely resembles the gen. However, resembles and equals are two different things. And you'd be destroying a really rare and beautiful pocketwatch, the same way some profit-driven Paneristi do for their frankenwatches. If you want something that closely resembles gen, may as well just modify a 616 with replica bridges; that's just as historically accurate/inaccurate as using this movement from a rare pocketwatch. Either way, the movement is not original to Panerai watches, and both ways they are coming from period pocketwatches, and anyone who really knows Panerai will know both are fakes, so why destroy a rare pocketwatch? It's one thing to take a movement from a very common Cort pocketwatch, but another to take one from a highly uncommon collectible Rolex pocketwatch, IMO.
I'm not so sure about that typing scheme and the inca. I thought only the very late movements in the 1950s had inca. I don't think original 3646 movements had it, just some of the later 6152 movements. All the info from the books is highly suspect because they claim many frankenwatches are original, and Perez uses a lot of conjecture (which is easy for disproving fakes, but very difficult for proving originals).
I wouldn't use this movement for a build because it's pretty clear from the markings that this is a movement from a pocketwatch that was not used in gen watches. I don't think it's any more "gen" than using an elinvar 622 movement, except that it more closely resembles the gen. However, resembles and equals are two different things. And you'd be destroying a really rare and beautiful pocketwatch, the same way some profit-driven Paneristi do for their frankenwatches. If you want something that closely resembles gen, may as well just modify a 616 with replica bridges; that's just as historically accurate/inaccurate as using this movement from a rare pocketwatch. Either way, the movement is not original to Panerai watches, and both ways they are coming from period pocketwatches, and anyone who really knows Panerai will know both are fakes, so why destroy a rare pocketwatch? It's one thing to take a movement from a very common Cort pocketwatch, but another to take one from a highly uncommon collectible Rolex pocketwatch, IMO.
- TimemiT
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Re: Interesting eBay Auctions
Agree .... now, if the movement were loose, then maybe different story. I believe it has more value as it is in it's current state.
yes, I was referencing Perez' photo where he shows the 618 Type 1, 2, 3 and 4 ... there is that debate about some of his movement evaluations ... thankfully my level of OCD and need to Replicate has not reached those levels of a $60K watch
Yoda .. probably reading this and thinking ... "what a bunch of morons .. Panerai, Rolex pcoketwatches .. Pfffffttt!!"
yes, I was referencing Perez' photo where he shows the 618 Type 1, 2, 3 and 4 ... there is that debate about some of his movement evaluations ... thankfully my level of OCD and need to Replicate has not reached those levels of a $60K watch
Yoda .. probably reading this and thinking ... "what a bunch of morons .. Panerai, Rolex pcoketwatches .. Pfffffttt!!"
Sandwich wrote: ↑October 14th, 2019, 7:22 pm Either way, the movement is not original to Panerai watches, and both ways they are coming from period pocketwatches, and anyone who really knows Panerai will know both are fakes, so why destroy a rare pocketwatch? It's one thing to take a movement from a very common Cort pocketwatch, but another to take one from a highly uncommon collectible Rolex pocketwatch, IMO.
Alpacalypse Now
- Sandwich
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Re: Interesting eBay Auctions
Glad we agree! And yes, a homeless movement is a whole different story!
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Re: Interesting eBay Auctions
I only can second this...Sandwich wrote: ↑October 14th, 2019, 7:22 pm Either way, the movement is not original to Panerai watches, and both ways they are coming from period pocketwatches, and anyone who really knows Panerai will know both are fakes, so why destroy a rare pocketwatch? It's one thing to take a movement from a very common Cort pocketwatch, but another to take one from a highly uncommon collectible Rolex pocketwatch, IMO.
It is a beautiful pocketwatch, especially with the engravings from April 1947 a even more rare find.
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Re: Interesting eBay Auctions
Hehe,thanks,luckily for the HF community,all the 1k posts are not from me
On a serious note,what do you guys think of the final price for that Rlx? Imo,it indeed indicates someone has greater plans than just pocket watch collecting.
- Yoda
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Re: Interesting eBay Auctions
LOL! No, not really, I do respect that we think differently.TimemiT wrote: ↑October 14th, 2019, 7:41 pm Agree .... now, if the movement were loose, then maybe different story. I believe it has more value as it is in it's current state.
yes, I was referencing Perez' photo where he shows the 618 Type 1, 2, 3 and 4 ... there is that debate about some of his movement evaluations ... thankfully my level of OCD and need to Replicate has not reached those levels of a $60K watch
Yoda .. probably reading this and thinking ... "what a bunch of morons .. Panerai, Rolex pcoketwatches .. Pfffffttt!!"
Sandwich wrote: ↑October 14th, 2019, 7:22 pm Either way, the movement is not original to Panerai watches, and both ways they are coming from period pocketwatches, and anyone who really knows Panerai will know both are fakes, so why destroy a rare pocketwatch? It's one thing to take a movement from a very common Cort pocketwatch, but another to take one from a highly uncommon collectible Rolex pocketwatch, IMO.
Enviado desde mi fucking Samsung S8.
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Re: Interesting eBay Auctions
Crazy price. I think this will end up in a build.
- Sandwich
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